There hasn't been a discussion in this section for a while, so I thought I'd throw one out to hear what people think. What is your definition of humility and egolessness, and what is your method of attaining these virtues?
Before anyone start to think and make their opinion, I throw this one With absolute humility, the ego dissolves. It is a collection of arbitrary mentations that gain force only because of vanity and habit. If one lets go of the vanity of thought, it dissolves. All thought is vanity. All opinions are vanities. The pleasure of vanity is therefore the basis of the ego – unplug it and it collapses. The Eye of The I From Which Nothing is Hidden, S. 238, 2001
I throw in some more quote from a teacher, because I don't know and if i start throwing my opinion is only based on my limited views we can discuss his quotes, in my opinion • The core of devotion is humility and the willingness to surrender all belief systems and illusions of 'I know'. Discovery of the Presence of God. Devotional Nonduality, S. ?, 2007 • Humility results in an open mind. An open mind says for the first time, "What is truth? Please, Lord, let me open my mind to know within my own consciousness what it the truth for my own self." Healing and Recovery, end of chapter Assisting Healing, S. 454, 2009 • The key to painless growth is humility, which amounts to merely dropping pridefulness and pretense, and accepting fallibility as a normal human characteristic of self and others. Along the Path to Enlightenment. 365 Reflections from David R. Hawkins, edited by Scott Jeffrey, S. 79, Reflection of May 28th, January 2011 • One has to see through the mind's illusion that it knows anything. This is called "humility" and has the value of opening the door for realizations, revelations, and intuitive knowingness. Along the Path to Enlightenment. 265 Reflections from David R. Hawkins, edited by Scott Jeffrey, S. 121, Reflection of August 16th, January 2011 • Humility is not just an attitude, but also a reality based on facts. With inner honesty [LoC 475], a devotee needs to realize the limitation inherent in just being human. Along the Path to Enlightenment. 365 Reflections from David R. Hawkins, edited by Scott Jeffrey, S. ?, Reflection of August 29th, January 2011 • Humility is of greater value than all factual accumulation. Unless one has completely and totally experienced the presence of God in its stunning, absolute Allness, it is safe to assume that one really knows nothing and that all accumulated so-called knowledge is really only tentative. Anything within that claims "I know" proves that it is false by that very statement, or else it would not make such a claim. Dissolving the Ego, Realizing the Self. Contemplations from the Teachings of David R. Hawkins, M.D., Ph.D. • To me, the key to all spiritual advancement is humility. In other words, the beginning realization is that what you think, how you feel, what you see. And what you think is going on has nothing to do with reality, and that is the kind of grand delusion which is some kind of vanity. The minute you begin to suspect that the product of your mind – its endless thoughts – is all nonsense, of probably no value whatsoever, there starts the beginning of a process. Then the person says, 'well, if I'm not experiencing reality as it really is in truth, then how is it in truth?' In A Course of Miracles, they use the term Holy Spirit. The next step is to say [...] 'My own perception is very partial and very biased, and therefore, I ask God to reveal to me the truth of what is really going on.' What eventually happens is a total transformation of perception. Interview with David Hawkins, Dialogues on Consciousness and Spirituality, part 2, S. 51, spiral binding, Veritas Publishing, Sedona, AZ, around 1998 • Question: Please explain how to differentiate true humility from pseudo-humility. Answer: Pseudohumility is a pose in which one wants to deny the pride one feels guilty about! It’s better not to feel guilty about it. Acknowledge where you are. From where you were, you are advanced, but from where you have to go, you are a beginner. In the world of idiots, you are a genius, but in the world of geniuses, you are an idiot! There is no point in feeling guilty about it. It's a natural thing. Sedona Seminar God vs. Science. Limits of the Mind, 4 CD set, 17. February 2007 == there are more, but those can be discussed first
Quotes are great, seeing as we can discuss our interpretations of those quotes. One question, how do you keep track of all these quotes? LOL. Anyway, please feel free to share your opinions. I think opinions are as important as quotes, because they offer other people's interpretations and understanding that we don't have. In essence, a new perspective on the same point. I'd personally rather hear opinions than read quotes lol. As this thread is about humility and egolessness, arguments and debates on different point-of-views have no place in here; so please share your opinions lol. edit: After having read these quotes, I'm starting to think that the existence (or lack thereof) of "God" or a god, and the idolization of a god, is not the point of the purpose of a god. Rather, it seems to like the "idea of a god" serves a more noble role. It keeps people grounded, it keeps people humble, because people are small and negligible compared to the "idea of a god". I'm Buddhist, I don't believe in a god, but I'm starting to very much appreciate the philosophical purpose and necessity of the "idea of a god". Though there's a difference between "the concept of a god" and "proving the existence of a god". IMO whether a god exists or not, it doesn't matter. I'd like to think a god doesn't exist. Those who idolize a god, or fight to prove/disprove god might be missing the point, I think. Anyway I digress. Concept of god or existence of god aside, many of these quotes refer to the state of enlightenment. Meditation is an integral component into reaching this state of enlightenment. Though I'm buddhist (albeit a terrible one), I'd like to understand how the ability to meditate helps cultivate humility and egolessness. Is it due to the self-control of one's mind that we are about to actively remain humble and lower our ego?
Proper meditation start to observe of one's mind and thoughts, and then it is when you are realised that you are not your mind / thought / opinions that you start to have natural humility and egolessness. But it is a slow and long process. And in my opinion, meditation is a start, and a good practice, but it is not enough, need more knowledge to explain them from proper books and teachers. And other inner works.
The concept of God is evolved as one study, experience, know more about God. God is as we are. quote: "If you believe in a punishing, vengeful God--clearly related to fight or flight--you won't see the reality of the Buddha's teaching of Nirvana. If you believe in the God of love envisioned by Jesus--rooted in the visionary response--you will not see the reality of the Greek myth wherein Saturn, primal father of the gods, ate all his children. Every version of God is part mask, part reality. The infinite can only reveal a portion of itself at any one time. Indeed, we would have all grown up, in the West at least, calling God "It" except for the linguistic anomaly that Hebrew has no neuter pronoun. In Sanskrit, the ancient Indians had no such problem and referred to the infinite deity as both It and That." that's from 'How to Know God' book, and in my opinion is helpful for me, when i want to know different concepts of God. Our human's thoughts and opinions are limited with our current beliefs which we got from current peers / books / outside influences. Quote "From thinking that we 'are' our minds, we begin to see that we 'have' minds, and that it is the mind that 'has' thoughts, beliefs, feelings and opinions. Eventually we may arrive at the insight that all our thoughts are merely borrowed from the great database of consciousness and were never really our own."
I would say it's more of a letting go of control and much about passivity (tho you could argue about actively being passive, but in meditation, those distinctions seem like they can just fall away). So it's less of a striving for a state of humility and selflessness, but a being. So I don't think there's one way for it. @warriorsage, interesting what you did on a meta level in your response
It seems that is the life chosen by Buddhist and Hindu monks. Aside from the obvious intensive meditation and way of life they adopt, they scrutinize ancient literature over and over again, in search for this "more knowledge" you mentioned. However for an average person who cannot adopt this way of life, what are some ways to "attempt" to reach this.. "enlightenment", or get as close to it as possible? Isn't the purpose of meditation to be MORE in control? It takes massive control and discipline to meditate properly, IMO, being able to push aside thoughts, control thoughts, so that when you meditate, all you focus on is nothingness
30 minutes a day meditation is all you need, and that is what proper teachers recommended. You still want to engage in the world. Maybe you don't have to be enlightened, and you don't have to. If you just want to embodied humility and egolessness. Those 'knowledge' is not necessary too. But maybe for their path and it's okie. And they are not necessarily become enlightened too after doing intensive mediation and more knowledge. But some fundamental explanations are necessary, from the proper teacher. There are many traps, tourist attractions and distractions in spiritual pursuits, that's why you need some proper teacher and knowledge too. Depends on what you want. edit: of course the above is my opinion too
I would say focus is different than control Like, in honing your focus, you can also let go of a feeling of needing to have control
@Dan .. okay .. just limited knowledge on Buddhism here so take it with a grain of salt. What's so called "enlightenment" in Buddhism is subjective because everyone is different .. our approach to life is different. However, I am 100% sure that the very basic and first step to enlightenment is "recognizing impermanence" When you truly understand and "practice" that very simple thing, you will absolutely see the world in different light. Meditation helps calm your thoughts and reflect on life. I am sure that most people know what impermanence is but to actually practice it, everyone failed including myself.
ceebz reading above responses... People with humility have more sparkles in their eyes in my opinion. you can tell what is on their mind and when you look into their eyes it seems personal to the both of you like you've just been lost in time for a second or two. Egotism is just people who over exaggerate accomplishments to create a false character of how they want to be seen by others in my opinion.
^lol, so can we just agree by saying that humility and egolessness is reached by being the opposite of nas?
