There's another thread about this just now here, in case you are wondering. And to answer your question, I don't really think it matters to me -- to be united with China means going VERY backwards and being prejudged against (in terms of budgets and other things) for a certainty, so I guess TW will get the short end of the deal for NOT being independent.
If you want an honest discussion about this, then first please refrain from using text speak here. I really dislike it when people say plx or something similar in a message board. In my own opinion, its perfectly acceptable that Taiwan wants to be an independant country and not have China tagged to it everwhere they go. China has no right to claim what is theirs if they were never part of the development of Taiwan and its government. Though I would not mind seeing a similar method used like in Hong Kong where its a 1 country 2 policy scheme. They are afterall, still Chinese people and I would love them to be a part of each other but with a diffrent name perhaps. What about you? You have not given us your views yet and I'm interested in what you think. Would it be right if China suddenly took over Taiwan?
Taiwan is not really a part of China because China (that is, the Communist Party) never finished what it started. The mainland and Taiwan all belonged to the KMT when the civil war started. The two sides fought and the KMT fled to Taiwan. The Communists did not follow them and finish them all. The Communists conquered the mainland, but they never fought for Taiwan. So how can China say they own Taiwan? When you overthrow a government you're supposed to wipe out all of the opposition. Anyway, Taiwan already is independent. Actually they were never a part of China, that is China as defined by being under the Communist Party. They didn't split from the Communists; the KMT existed before the Communists. There should be no question of independence.
Taiwan has been part of China since the Qing Dynasty (and before that, under Zheng Chenggong during the Ming). Taiwan technically does not exist, but the Republic of China (currently administering Taiwan) on the other hand, does. Which means Taiwan is still part of China, just not part of the People's Republic of China. Anyway...all separatists should die. -noclue -censored
Call it Taiwan or call it the Republic of China--it's just a name. The Qing Dynasty owned it all until the Nationalists overthrew them. Then they owned it all. Then the Communists overthrew the Nationalists. All except for the group that fled to Taiwan. The R.O.C. belonged to the Nationalists at the time, but the Communists let them stay there. They didn't finish the job. There is no separatism here. The Communists have never controlled Taiwan. Taiwan has never been under a Communist government. So what makes the Communists think they have any right to it? The Communists were the revolutionaries. They separated from the KMT. I'm not saying the Communists have no right to the mainland. They won the fight so it's theirs, that's the way conquest goes. But they never conquered Taiwan (or the Republic of China, whatever you want to call it). Pretend this is a game of Risk and it's pretty clear. You have to actually step foot in a place to own it.
Don't think it's a valid reason, just because Hong Kong, after colonization, is returned to China, does not equate Taiwan should be the same. Afterall, when the Japanese withdrew from Taiwan, China wasn't at the table -- in that sense, it doesn't seem logical for Taiwan NOT to be independent from China.
I didn't like the fact HK was taken in by China.. the economy went down because of the merge.. So I wouldn't agree for Taiwan and China to merge. Let Taiwan be!
Wrong. By your logic, if Taiwan is already "independent" (de-facto independence does not mean shit here), then why does the Taiwanese separatists (namely the DPP and other morons) want to "separate"? How can you "separate" when you are already independent? Fact is, Taiwan is not independent. The name is very important, the Republic of China refers to all former Chinese territories it obtained after the collapse of the Qing Dynasty. Taiwan is currently under the administration of the ROC. The Chinese civil war technically has not concluded yet, which explains why the Mainland must recover Taiwan in order to make sure that IT is the rightful administrator of China. Also, political parties have nothing to do with this issue. Even if the People's Republic never "controlled" Taiwan, it is still part of China in the form of the ROC. This is written in the constitution of the ROC. Also, keep in mind that the KMT (Guo Min Dang) is the Chinese Nationalist Party, which explains why they are favorable towards the issue of reunification. In short, Taiwan is still part of China.
Taiwan has its own government, makes its own laws, prints its own currency...I don't know how you can get more independent than that. Taiwan wants recognition as an independent country; they don't want to separate. Anyway, I do think it would be better for Taiwan' economy if they did go back to China. A lot of jobs in Taiwan are going over to China anyway. But Taiwan is not rightfully China's. Political parties are very important here; the whole conflict originated because two parties were fighting each other. The Communists didn't finish off the KMT, yet now they expect Taiwan to just hand itself over. Who would willingly accept that arrangement? I guess I'm just sympathetic towards Taiwan. After all, who would choose to be under such an oppressive Communist government, a government that at one point tried to destroy its own people's culture?
Did you even read what I wrote? There is no such thing as "Taiwan" as far as the official name is concerned. The ROC is currently de-facto independent, however what is under dispute is the de-jure status of the ROC. The ROC is not recognized diplomatically and most countries adhere to the PRC's One China Policy. Also, Hong Kong has its own mini-administration, laws and currency, what makes it different from Taiwan? Nothing really. Like I said earlier, Taiwan is still part of China - not part of the PRC, but in the form of the ROC. The conflict in question is still a continuation from the Chinese civil war, which technically has not concluded even today. This is only an issue between the legitimacy of the ROC and PRC and has nothing to do with Taiwan (aside from the fact that this is where the ROC temporarily resides). I'm not even going to comment on your baseless attack on the so-called "Communist" government, like it or not, it has been doing a good job for the past 20 years.
China will never give up on taking back Taiwan as its own. That's why I don't think Taiwan will ever be Independent.
Independent or not, is irrelevant. No country of importance even has relations with them. List of countries with diplomatic relations with the ROC Dates indicate establishment or duration of relations; * indicates an embassy in Taipei Africa (4 states) Burkina Faso* (1994) Gambia* (1995) São Tomé and Príncipe* (1997) Swaziland* (1968) Europe (1 state) Vatican City* (The Holy See) (1942) Oceania (6 states) Kiribati (2003) Marshall Islands* (1998) Nauru (1980–2002, 2005) Palau* (1999) Solomon Islands* (1983) Tuvalu (1979 Central & South America (12 states) Belize* (1989) Dominican Republic* (1957) El Salvador* (1961) Guatemala* (1960) Haiti* (1956) Honduras* (1965) Nicaragua* (1990) Panama* (1909) Paraguay* (1957) Saint Kitts and Nevis* (1983) Saint Lucia (1984–1997, 2007) Saint Vincent and the
You forgot the United States. Considering that the US is still the PRC's best customer, largest debtor and largest stumbling block towards PRC takeover of Taiwan; in that regard, the US is the country of most importance, diplomatic relations or not. As for no diplomatic relations; things may not be what they seem at first blush. The American Institute in Taiwan, though unofficial, is staffed with US state department employees who are technically "on leave" but who continue to accrue state department seniority. The AIT will issue US passports and visas. Directors of the AIT are equal in rank to US ambassadors. Inotherwords, the AIT is a de facto US embassy in all but name.
all the AIT does is do visas and allow US to sell weapons for "defense". you added the so called "de facto US embassy" to the wiki article. ROC isnt even allowed into the United Nations. well rather, they were replaced.
See this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:De_facto_embassies I responded to your opinion position of "No country of importance even has relations with them" which IMHO is untrue. The US does have very important relations with Taiwan. If that were not the case, China is then arguably afraid to move on a wayward province with nothing more than a bunch of third world punk nations on it's side. Why is that? Maybe it's because Taiwan just got, from a country of no importance that it has no relations with, several Patriot3 missile batteries? As for the ROC being replaced, that was a outcome matter of the one China policy. The rest is rather convoluted and I'm not about to launch into a pro vs con about Taiwanese membership in addition to PRC membership simultaneously. Suffice to say that volumes have been written in argument for both sides and there is legal precedence for both. In the end, the Taiwan question would likely be a political solution. If the PRC relies on use of force, it would put a real damper on the world economy, but mostly the mainland's. No one is going to want to buy cheap goods from an aggressor. The PRC's best bet is to schmooze Taiwan's next several generations with great business deals, education, travel, whatever, in order to entice the young Taiwanese into their camp. Once the older anti-PRC generation dies off, the younger will remember nothing but good things about the PRC (and not the murderous excesses of Mao). A political solution would then be possible to "reunite" Taiwan with the PRC. However, if it keeps talking about how it's going to use force? Right, that's like asking a girl out and if she says no, you threaten her? LOL... That's real smooth there buddy.
