I know this seems like a vague title and I have a bad feeling that this topic is susceptible to being trolled or leading to me getting abused for basically "throwing out my heritage." But yeah so, why did I come up with this thread? Well I've only just come back after half a year from this and started reading through a few of the posts. I don't know why but it added to my thoughts of this whole identity crisis thing. Just to set some background information: I'm of Vietnamese (and 1/4 Chinese) descent, but I was born in the UK. Throughout secondary/high school, I've felt a strong allegiance to Vietnam and took pride in being Vietnamese (it's kinda weird even though I'm not fully Vietnamese). But throughout these years, I feel like I'm losing touch with my pride, replacing it with a pro-British attitude. I don't know why, but I guess it's partly to where I'm in and reading about politics, history etc. and also realisation on my birth place and citizenship. Also after trying to learn Mandarin in school, I realised how my roots from my grandparents and great-grandparents and further back have been completely non-existent. Only 3 or 4 people in my extended family can speak any form of Chinese but the rest all speak either Vietnamese and/or their language of where they're born (in my case English). For some reason, that realisation of non-existence of a part of my roots has led to me basically drifted me away from my "claims" of Vietnamese pride and more towards British. On forms I used to put a dual identity of British-Vietnamese, but more recently I've just been using British, whilst keeping my ethnicity as Vietnamese. I don't know, but I'm curious to know if anyone who was born overseas of Asian descent ever have this feeling, or whether they still stick strong with their heritage and have some pride as if they were a native from that country. I know in US there are a greater number of Asians overall (regardless of Chinese, Korean, Japanese, Vietnamese, Thai, Filipino etc.), so I guess it's going to be hugely different. But I just wanted to find out whether people have pride more for their country of birth or their heritage. Sorry for a slightly controversial topic, but it was bugging me and I thought the only way that I could get it off my mind was to ask about it. I've attached a poll (or at least I've tried to), just to see how other people see whereabouts they are.
I take pride being Chinese in my school. Listening to asian(Canto+Japanese) songs, I dont feel a little shame in not listening to American music at all. So if you ask me whats the hittest American song at the moment, i seriously wont know. I'm from Canada. But from that being said.. i wasn't born overseas. I was born in HK & was raised in Canada since 6.
I'm Vietnamese, born in Canada. I pride myself on being Vietnamese, speak its language, uphold its culture and tradition. I actively participate in Vietnamese events, whether they are school events, public events, etc. However I am also proud to be Canadian. I wouldn't call myself Vietnamese-Canadian, as that implies that I am a Canadian of Vietnamese ethnicity. I am a Vietnamese and a Canadian.
I'm Chinese born in Canada. Growing up i've also encountered this dilemma, which side do i choose? the choice is not easy, when you are a minority and have people telling you to go back to your country. When i look at myself without a doubt i am Chinese, but i also believe that Canada is my home and when i die i will be buried here. I like to see it as Canada playing the father role and my Chinese heritage playing the mother role, and in this way i will not have turned my back on either side. I believe most Asians that grew up overseas have an identity crisis. Some got submitted early on, and only have negative things to say about their culture. On the other side we have those that refuse to adapt and assimilate, would you consider going to war to protect the country that raised you? Asians that grew up overseas have it tough, but there are also some advantages such as a broadened view of the world. We are able to be critical of both the east and west with the least amount of bias. In the end, we reap the benefits from both ends at the cost of our identity.
ABC here... A for Oz though.. proud of being chinese, always have, always will... Glad my folks forced me to attend chinese school in my younger days... can read and write and have them to thank for it. I look at some ABCs and they've lost all their heritage... forgotten their roots. To me think that's not acceptable. You are who you are, be proud and don't forget your own heritage and culture.
The thing that's really funny about questions like this, is that they're geared towards eliciting a cultural emotional response that is almost always a positive for one's ethnicity. There's nothing wrong with that, but the danger is that often, such responses can become politicized. That is, that just because someone is say, Chinese, that they should naturally be pro China. That isn't the case, nor should it be. For example, I'm Chinese, love the Chinese people, culture and history (been to Chinese schools, speak fluently), but I hate the Chinese government. So while I will say that I'm of Chinese ethnicity (and proud of it too, mind you), I'm 100% American politically (I would never be able to stand it if I had to live in China). But, I've found more than a few Chinese people, who mistakenly assume that since they are Chinese, that they somehow should hold political allegiance to the People's Republic of China. In that vein, there in lies a question that had stumped politicians for years; that is, where do you classify the diaspora of other nations when such peoples, whose allegiance you suspect, are within your national borders? Do you consider them full fledged citizens with all rights thereof, or do you regard them as a perilous fifth column, about to strike at the heart of your nation from within? Historically, the Turks answered this question by marching out the Armenians, while the Viet boated out the Chinese, and in WW2 the Americans imprisoned the Japanese. Thus, staunchly puffing out one's chest and loudly proclaiming one's ethnic culture has more than just personal pride as a reward; it has political consequence. I don't know how many of you remember the illegal immigration debates currently in the US press. But several years ago, illegal Mexican immigrants and those that favored their cause made a huge public relations gaffe. They basically showed Americans that they didn't want to become Americans, but rather instead, wanted to make the United States a northern province of Mexico: When one waves the flag of a nation, one is publicly stating favor for their style of governance, their way of running things, and their way of treating people. So, in that vein, would I ever wave the flag of the PRC? No. Politically, they don't give people the voice of expression. They're aggressively claiming territory with expansionist views on all their neighbors, and instead using the rule of law, they essentially rule by law (that is, they write laws to control others while ignoring such laws themselves). Or, let's ask ourselves this: those pictures (above) of Mexicans rallying in public, waving Mexico's flag; would that ever happen in China? LOL...
I'm basically the same as Ralph and Dan. I'm of Chinese and Vietnamese decent, although I recognize myself as more Chinese than Vietnamese cause of how I was raised and what traditions I follow. I was born and have lived in Canada my whole life and I have a great deal of pride for our great country. I can't imagine being raised somewhere else, and that includes China. Although I am also very proud of my Chinese heritage and enjoy learning about the vast history of our culture, I can't stand the current PRC regime.
if ur blood is chinese ur chinese.. if ur African and born in China people are still gonna call you African. Citizenship can always be changed.
China is too busy claiming territory on all it's neighbours lol they're probably invading North Korea right now, aggressively at that too! Out of curiosity Ralph, can you proudly raise the American flag nowadays? And you probably wouldn't see the Mexicans rallying in China because there just aren't that many Mexicans there.
Yes, but that was a tongue in cheek satirical analogy; directed at the political impossibility of that. But what they do have in China right now is about a million illegal Koreans, who won't dare show their heads in public. Even babies born in China (of Chinese fathers & illegal Korean women), where by law, are supposed to be recognized as Chinese citizens, are nonetheless treated as non citizens and sent to the DPRK, where they're usually killed. As for proudly waving one's flag; my observation is that most people regardless of what they say with their mouths, really wave flags with their feet. That is, they all go to the places that they genuinely love and depart the places that they don't. Some may call it economic migration, but I simply refer to it as voting with one's feet. Talking about being proud or not of America? Well, I'm here in the US and not in China (or anywhere else, for that matter). What's curiously ironic about that is, so are many self professed pro-PRC Chinese, LOL... Like, yeah, China's so great, that's why you're here, right? Along with 20 million Mexicans, LOL... Beijing Increases Detentions of Illegal North Korean Immigrants Korean Children Left in China As for your disbelief at PRC border aggression, just look up and read about the long standing years of clandestine Chinese road building across national borders. If you took the time, you'll find that just about every nation that borders with the PRC has some sort of land boundary dispute. The PRC had fought border wars with India, Vietnam, and Russia simply because those countries were willing to stand up for themselves. Those that didn't just had territory taken. The 1962 Sino Indian War The Sino-Soviet Border Conflict, 1969 Chinese Invasion of Vietnam Bhutan's Northern Border: China's Bullying and Teasing Tactics Tajikistan Cedes 1,000 Kilometers of Disputed Border Area to China As for China invading North Korea? Frankly, I wish they would and finally put an end to the most dangerous element in the Pac Rim. Both China and South Korea would benefit. However, it is China's fondest wish that the US and ROK invade. That way, the can call the US an aggressive bully while they secretly thank their communist gods that the west took care of their ugly unruly "socialist" cousin.
These are claims to land that can be disputed by both sides, but you've obviously concluded that China is in the wrong from sources that are questionable. Lets just say that they are in the wrong, the result of all these minor squirmishes lead to barely any deaths, compared to the slaughter that is happening in iraq right now, it's insignificant. Mind you, all these squirmishes occured over a 50 year span, and that is hardly aggresively claiming territory with expansionist views on all their neighbours. So what would you have them do with the illegals coming into china? shoot them like how they shoot the mexicans trying to jump the border? I'm not a communist or anything like that, but i think it's ok to give China a pat on the back sometime. People will jump at every chance to criticize China, but will look the other way when they do something right. Is the basis of your condemnation for China built upon moral integrity or is it just a part of your personal agenda? if it's moral integrity do you also put the USA under such microscopic scrutiny? Last question, did the PRC take your house?
Do I agree with the US over the Iraq war? Absolutely not. My opinion has always been that the Bush Administration lied, and "weapons of mass destruction" (the reason that we went to war) were soon found to be only Words of Mass Deception. The US taxpayer and citizens have been paying billions of dollars and with thousands of American lives. Indeed, the indiscriminate "collateral" killings of a likely estimated half million Iraqi civilians during the bulk of the war is something that needs to be criminally investigated. My personal belief is that Dick Cheney (and his oil cronies) should have been brought to trial and shot. But the oil industry has had a deep hold on US politics and even with a change in administration, there hasn't been any more accountability than before. Just one look at the post BP Spill Gulf will bear that out, as Obama is just as deeply reluctant to tackle big oil. And as for China doing things right? Socially the best thing that the Chinese Communists ever did was eliminate the centuries old Chinese tradition of Foot Binding. And despite Mao not following his own edict, polygamy and better rights for women over what they had before did happen on his watch. However, it was all the bad things that the CCP did, and continues to do today that has me giving their style of governance a big thumbs down. As for II's, er... what Mexicans were shot trying to jump the border? Insofar as government policy, the US policy is to never shoot unless an official's life is in danger. There has been several armed vigilante groups stopped by the US government from doing exactly what you stated, that is, shooting illegal Mexicans who simply trespass onto private US property. Did the PRC take my house? No, because I live in the US. But did the PRC ever take people's houses (or other property)? Yes, in 1949 when they nationalized just about everything in the name of "for the people." All those old beautiful European styled houses in Shanghai for example, were stolen by the government. This includes factories, hotels, manufacturing plants, warehouses, etc. When the CCP took over, they took everything; and now they control everything. Those that didn't take to their style of "governance" were subjected to reeducation. But please, don't take my word for it, Try these: Laogai--The Chinese Gulag by Hongda Harry Wu [video=youtube;mEYLIEQSX2g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEYLIEQSX2g[/video] As for taking houses in the present, just read up on what happened in the run up to the China Olympics. Or, what happens when local party officials need land to sell to a developer. Read about what happens to the people that complain. As for the border skirmishes that occurred over a fifty year span, that burnishes the reality that it has been and consistently continues to be Chinese national policy. The same aggressively expansionist tactics is evident in how the PRC views the South China Sea. China states that the entirety of the SCS, up the 12 mile limit from the shores of all nations there; should belong to China. As for the sources, you're more than welcome to look up your own. What I'm saying is, there is an issue there. As for putting the US and China together under microscopic scrutiny? I have, and the US, as bad as it is, remains politically much more favorable a place to exist for me than China. This has nothing to do with being ethnically Chinese or Chinese culture. What I'm talking about is based entirely on the political and the impact on people's lives therefrom. If the situation was suddenly flipped, and the US government ran Beijing and Zhongnanhai ran Washington I would immediately move to the PRC and renounce my US citizenship. This isn't just with China (ie for or against), I've thought the same with many other large nations (like the US, the former Soviet Union, Colombia, France, United Kingdom, etc). That is, I'm not just comparing China and the US (which is what many Chinese people do). China, as a political entity, relies on good will from an ignorant diaspora to provide political support abroad. If Chinese overseas really understood what the PRC government is capable of, then a lot of that support would disappear. That can only be done with discussion and education. However, education generally is hard to accomplish as most people become settled in their views and don't want to hear about anything else (This isn't necessarily a Chinese trait, but rather a human failing in general). An interesting political corollary to this is the US support for Israel. The Jewish Israelis keep their nation running as well as it has by stoking US Jews to beseech US politicians for support in suppression of the Palestinians, a people with just as much right to the lands controlled by Israel. In many ways, the Israelis politically act very similar to China.
