Hi guys, The torch just came pass Australia this week. I was watching the news about the protesters about china human rights and tibet problem. i would like to know what you guys think about these protesters? I personally think these protesters a trouble makers. the protesters in Australia is mainly australian (westerns) i really want to know what does it got to do with you? does it effect you? there is so many issues in the world why dont you guys care about them? even the chinese hasnt said anything yet. what do you guys think?
i think they are doing what they think is right to get attention and the best way to do it is when the world is watching otherwise they would have little option to let the world know. Im neutral about it as long as no one gets hurt.
I was neutral because everyones got a right to air their views and protests are fine, but since they started trying to grab the flame, and even egg it, thats just a step to far in my opinion and now I have personally lost favour for their side
exactly the same, protesting is fine as long as its peaceful, but trying to steal the flame and stuff just makes them as bad and shows that they are troublemakers.
There's an art of subtlety to protest, and also defense against protest that the PRC hasn't yet learned. Suppose there was no one to "guard" or protect the flame, no phalanx of Chinese Special Police (in their 'sporting" blue windbreakers) to surround the torch bearer. Now imagine this, a pro Tibet Indy protester jumps out of the crowd, grabs the flame, throws it to the ground, and stomped it out while the torch bearer just stood and watched, along with the cameras rolling. In that one instance, all that Tibet protesters have worked for would go down the drain of bad press. Now, where would all the sympathies go? China hasn't learned to be subtle. By highlighting the fact that they consider the torch as too important a symbol, they painted a nice big fat bullseye on it, for militant Tibetans to any Joe blow who just wants to get on the Tele. The PRC really needs to outsource some of their political strategy. Ralph
so ur basically saying that if they did not guard the flame and let some pro tibetian get it and extinguish it, then the tibetians will be shown to be the ones in the wrong.
Well, they'll certainly get a lot less sympathy from people who are watching, and more importantly, it would give the PRC the appearance of being more so the victim of protester maliciousness. The world loves victims; if you're cut and bleeding, public opinion will always be on your side. But if you're swinging a cudgel, then you're always going to be seen as the bad guy. If such a thing were to happen, and the PRC not only did nothing to stop it, but take no retaliatory action, then it would come out smelling like roses. Instead, Beijing is so predictable, that is why the protesters are purposely making the attempts. Mind you, they don't have to even touch the torch. All they need to do is to lunge and get beat up or shoved by the PRC goon protecting the torch and voila... another message to the world has been sent. The PRC is shown to be heavy handed once again. See, the PRC never really had to worry about public relations before. In China, they think and do as they please. Anyone who doesn't like it gets slapped in jail or a bullet in the back of their head. That is how they're used to doing business. Now they're trying to go from a closed insular society with strict controls into an arena where they have little or no control; and guess what? Its a whole new ball game and they're not even in the minor leagues yet. The PRC is really amateur when it comes to these things and it shows. They need to hire some good old US public relations firms to tell them how to make people feel good about China Inc. They're only learning this in recent years, especially with the high rate of overseas product failures. In other words, stuff that they can get away with at home hasn't a chance to see daylight on an international stage. They're playing with the big boys now and they're just learning what that means. Ralph
This protesting for Human Rights excuse is utter chicken shit. Protestants who "protest" against China abusing Tibet's Human Rights don't realize that they are violating INDIVIDUAL Human Rights themselves. In England and France, protestors bully and abuse people of Chinese decent, or in some cases BORN in England or France, EVEN THOUGH those Chinese citizens are neutral in this Chino-Tibetan issue. In other words, they are not for China, nor are they for Tibet. And yet they still get glass bottles thrown at them, and abused by angry protestants. Now tell me, where the hell are Human Rights in there? Furthermore, I think the Chino-Tibetan issue has NOTHING to do with Human Rights issue. That's merely the surface story. The more in depth issue is of an economic factor. I'm not going to go into that as you can read my view in the "Tibet a free nation? I think not" or something. People must realize that they're using the Human Rights issue has a disguise just like Bush' war on Terrorism (which is in fact the conquer for oil). It is the same has the Crusades, where it used the excuse of "Holy War", where in fact it was a "Money War".
while I agree that some aspects of Dann's comments, are perfectly vaild, an article here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7369471.stm has pointed out how this torch relay has become the PRC's biggest nightmare. Its not just about Tibet any more, as any gripe or grievance that anyone has was the PRC is now being piggybacked onto the torch route. Japanese nationalists (who have a beef with China's repeated demands that Japan come clean with acknowledgement of war crimes) came out along with Tibet pro indy's, and now Koreans who don't want to see DPRK refugees in china returned, are expected to show up in force... As this drags on, more and more anti PRC political issues will be tacked onto this torch target. So far from it being a victory lap onto the world stage for China, this has become a whack a mole road show in every city, where the "mole" is China. Not exactly what Zhongnanhai had in mind when they sign up for this, eh? Talk about public relations disaster. Ralph
happening wherever the torch goes i guess ... happened here in San Francisco as well; so much so that they had to cancel a few events. but i support the protesters. China has never been known for its human rights. And I can't stand how the Chinese government are able to order harsh action on those monks and how they were trying to cover it up by refusing entries to the reporters! What a load of injustice!
lol yea i saw on the news, how funny it was too see that most of the protesters were western.but then again they might all beleive/follow the daili lama
Running with the Olympic torch is a once in a lifetime opportunity, and these protesters are ruining the experience for these people. Surely each nation commits some form of atrocity on a daily basis, why not focus your protesting efforts on that? Maybe they just want a quick chance to get on TV or something...
These protesters arent helping their cause, instead it has made me resent them and has not made me feel sorry for their causes. The olympics has nothing to do with politics, pple from all around the world has trained for this event for their country, and sure wat they are protesting about shd be knwn to the world but not in this way, let the event be wat it is suppose to be and that is to unite good sportsman around the world, and not make wat shd be entertainment to the world a political scandal.
Surely you must see the irony of what you're saying? "Once in a lifetime opportunity..." when the PRC has ruin the entire lifetimes of Tibetans, in our lifetime. That, I think, is what protesters want to do, to make people realize that while they may bear the inconvenience of not seeing a sporting event compared to the lifelong conditions that the PRC has subjected them to. So many of the respondents here fail to see that they're essentially advocating a sporting venue over that of human rights and dignity. Though everyone is free to pick and choose what is important to them, I personally find many of the choices offered here to be morally bankrupt and ethically appalling. And again, like I had stated before in another thread, asking why doesn't the world look at another problem is not an answer to a question. There will always be another question, but referring to it isn't any way of answering the one before you; ie avoidance. It got run over by the PRC armored regiments that rolled into Tibet last month. If you examine the history of the Olympics over the last century, you'll realize that your statement will be proven to be entirely false. Politics may never have been the motive, but it is, in fact, a VERY large part of the Olympics; from the selection of the venue to the participation of the athletes, and to the selection of the IOC reps from each country. Ralph
