yeah the system is broke... it's been broke for years... I totally agree and feel for everyone that's suffering right now, but this new $40million dollar( in reality it's just a new $17million legislature and it will be about 2% of the entirety of the financial aide in all of California) legislature is just a stepping stone for things to change... and bro here's a quick and ez way to think of it... would you rather have illegals that have a college degree from California schools, or have them all get kicked out and become gangbangers like ecko makes them out to be? I don't fault ppl for being angry at this, but damn there comes a time to realize that you're fcking bitching bout the wrong thing... economy sucks right now not because of illegals, but because idiots from the last generation fcked up bad...
They really need to fix the financial aid system, as in providing aid to only those that need it. I don't think the real problem is providing aid to the people that NEED it, it's also giving these financial aid to those that DON'T. I've seen people receive THOUSANDS of grant and loan money. That is just ONE person. If you multiply that by thousands, then you got a lot of money wasted on those that didn't deserve it. I've applied and received financial aid once. I got tuition covered with another $2,700 to spend. I'd imagine it was more or less with some other people, even hearing that one girl was granted up to $12,000 per semester. Anyone and their moms can receive aid if they bullshit on the application. Honestly, it's ignorant to say that illegal immigrants do not pay taxes. If you look it up, they actually do. And they contribute a lot to taxes too in fact. If you think illegal immigrants are the only ones that are looking for handouts and not paying taxes, think again. There are a lot of shady people out there, too. Don't blame the illegals for trying to better themselves, blame the ones that leech off society without contributing back. And yes, I did attend school in California. Shortage of classes and an increase in tuition almost every semester. In the time I went to my Cal State college, the tuition raised almost $1,000 in 3 years. It was horrible when they had mandatory furlough days. If I had a choice, I'd rather give the money to the illegals that want to get a degree and to those that truly need it. At least they will probably do something with the degree.
Anti-immigrant sentiment has been something of a sovereign issue for centuries, and it certainly isn't exclusive to the US. Personally, I think instead of invading Iraq, the US should have invaded and annexed Mexico. That way, Mexicans could have instantly become American citizens and the "illegal" issue would have simply evaporated overnight, LOL... -bigsmiles Like stand on the unemployment line with the rest of the college graduates.
I'm sure you're just being funny/trolling, but I guess I'll bite. Personally, I think children of illegal immigrants and immigrants in general make better use of financial aid then most American citizens in general. With their sense of entitlement, they seem less motivated to do well as opposed to immigrants who are so grateful for the opportunity.
I want to see some statistics in here because all the people who are saying illegals work harder in school and deserve the money more than normal Americans aren't being any more "ignorant" than the rest. Gimme proof! Because I know plenty of immigrants/illegal immigrants who are failures in school. We are all the same, some of us work hard and some of us don't. You tell people against this that they're wrong because illegals deserve the money more but where is the proof! The only example in here that I've seen is the Fresno State student body president dude. &that is only one person. I'm not saying they shouldn't get any money AFTER everyone else gets money, but whoever argued that normal Americans who "dont deserve" the money should have their money taken away and given to the illegals is just wrong. We are the legal ones, therefore we should be prioritized!
I'm not saying they all deserve it more. I'm just saying that they should distribute the money in better ways than just offering it as a handout to those that ask for it. You can NOT need the financial aid, ask for it, and still receive it... which i think is the problem. But, I agree, there's the hard-working students and then there are slackers. Both legal or illegal. Like I said before, I was able to ask for aid when I didn't need it, and was able to receive enough aid to cover tuition cost plus almost $3,000 left over for me to spend. Want to know why? I didn't need to include my parents income on the form because I was considered independent, although I was still living at home. At the time, I was not working so, technically, I had zero income. I applied for financial aid and I received A LOT. Although I did this so my parents did not have to pay for my tuition anymore, but can you see how easy it is for people so undeserving (like me LOL) to receive money? The system is broken edit: I don't really have any statistics, but I will say that most illegals can only get jobs that NO AMERICANS want to do. Shit jobs that doesn't require a brain or any kind of real thinking. Isn't it obvious the reason why the illegals, as well as any person, to get a college degree is so they can apply for better paying jobs? If you want another example, there was this one really bright korean guy I know. His English is even better than mine, and he is really smart. He had a really high GPA, was active in clubs and was even the President for our club. But he can't drive because he can't apply for a license, and he couldn't get a good job because he has no visa so he worked for his parents instead (they owned a restaurant). Eventually, after graduation, he was able to find a job in a large accounting firm but he could not work for them unless he had a working visa or became a citizen. His girlfriend married him so he could obtain citizenship and now he is doing better than what most college graduates are doing, like Ralph said, standing around unemployed
Great thread. I love the different perspectives being thrown around here. I agree with certain points on both sides of the argument. Over 30% of my paycheck goes to taxes and that's 30% of my own hard earned money. I went through college and have a shit ton, and I mean a SHIT TON of loans just so I can get a decent job to pay back my loans and to get a decent job. Although a bit selfish, but I am certainly NOT happy knowing some of that 30% is going to financial support for illegal immigrants for a variety of things. I honestly don't know how I feel about illegal immigrants, because 100% of my family came here legally and we went through thick and thin to make it today. But at the same time, I wish there are those who can enjoy the rights and privileges we have without the sense of entitlement because knowing that I have the power to share my wealth, I'd gladly do so for moral reasons. But I guess I just don't like being forced to spoon feed someone who thinks they deserve it. I wish I can control where my tax dollars are going.
This is exactly my point. My tax dollars are going to support you because you don't want your parents to support you and even when you didn't need it. But at the very least, you're a citizen while there are illegal students who expect the hand out like they are entitled to it. You're absolutely right, the system is broken.
For me anyways, I said "illegal immigrants and immigrants". Just look at UCLA, and see how many minorities make up the student population.
You know, the problem with these arguments are that they push on hot button emotional issues that, on the scale of things, don't really matter a whole hell of a lot. By that I mean, the things like the Savings and Loan bailout, which started a long line of subsequent Wall Street rescue plans, at the cost of billions to the American taxpayer, could probably have funded the next few centuries of tuition for both legal and illegal immigrant education. So while we're sitting here arguing and pissing each other off, the guy that owns your credit card account just ripped all of us off another few bucks each. The point is, there's a lot to be pissed off about in the world, and though I don't agree with providing free tuition for illegal immigrants, that's an issue pretty low on my list of overall importance in the scheme of things. As for children of illegals making better use of the American education system because they have more to lose? Some do, but others turn out to be gang bangers; go figure, eh?
Your living off your parents at the time how did you know that you did NOT need it lol. Were you lying about you guys being lower class and you guys were actually middle class or what? Could your parents have payed for all your tuition, books etc by themselves and still afford to pay you to live your life hang out with friends etc? The thing is if you are lower class you need that college money more than you probably knew. The Korean guy you talked about how many illegal immigrants are similar lol thats one in thousands or so unless they choose majors that give extra payoffs etc who cares if you are active in clubs/ presidents. Most of those people have too much time and are usually psychology or communication majors or some liberal art major that barely get jobs when they come out. What if these guys never get girlfriend/boyfriends in the states what happens?
Lol there is definitely a line that should be drawn there to become a legal immigrant there's a lot more paper work to go through there and a lot more money spent and a lot more time wasted to go through. Its like studying hard for a test vs cheating for one. Risking your life to get over the border/ risking your college enrollment to pass a test and actually getting rewarded financial aid for it! Well thats not all of it theres more factors contributing to being an illegal immigrant in that you can actually empathize for them vs cheating for a test. But thats my analogy.
if they work and contribute to society then its all good imo. Its when they come and mess up the economy sending all their money back to their countries that problems can arise.
It's a bad idea, we are already in trouble with financial aids for legal college students, now that Cal is giving it to illegals, not smart.
When I say I didn't need the aid, I meant that I had no trouble paying for tuition. If I didn't have my parents to pay for me, of course I would ask. But I primarily looked for the aid for spending money and to negate the rising tuition cost. I didn't lie on the application. The thing is, I've applied a few times before I was finally accepted. My parents were more than able to afford putting both my sister and I through college at the same time. They were even paying for her rent expense while she moved out. The first few times I applied for FA,. I was under 24, so my parents were still able to claim me as a dependent on their tax forms. Because of that I also had to include their their information, etc etc. But once I hit 24, I didn't have to anymore, and that's why I was able to exclude them. As for the Korean immigrant, my point wasn't about whether or not he was able to find a job. My point was that there ARE hard working ones out there and that everyone deserves a chance at a better life. I only included the tidbits about his life after graduation to show you what kind of restrictions they face. Obviously their parents came here in hopes of building a better future for later generations and a better chance for their child.
The thing is if you didnt lie about the income etc then you should have gotten aid college isn't just all tuition if you commute theres car insurance/gas (depending how far you live) or if your living there eating costs etc. Your parents might have been able to put you through college but damn they must be damned relieved they didnt have to lol. They have a life too! But you've applied several times? so was your parents income too high or what? Yeah there are hard working ones but there are hard working ones but if they can't even get a job without getting married (if they have a child that would be a bigger problem) then what's the point?
Maybe I worded my statement wrong. When I applied for FA at first, I only qualified for loans. Because my parents were able to afford the tuition, I just ignored the loans and went with paying the tuition cost upfront. Once I hit 24, I was able to qualify for grants (free money) as well as the loans. I just took the grant money, which was more than enough to cover tuition and other expenses, and I ignored the loans. And yea, my household income was significantly above the threshold so before i was able to exclude my parent's from the FA application, I only qualified for loans. If I were to change the system, I would just leave the FREE money to scholarships and remove the grant money all together. Free money from scholarships should just be an incentive for students that choose to do well in school anyway. The FA system should just be a loan system, so they are guaranteed some of the money back from those that are able to pay it off. edit: by the way I think the way they distribute who gets how much needs to be revised. This girl I know, 18, living with a single parent, was able to receive almost $12,000 per semester. Our tuition at that time was only about $2,200. So that's pretty much overkill already.
